Jan & Dean: Official Message Board for Jan Berry

JAN & DEAN => DON'T YOU JUST KNOW IT => Topic started by: jdman on May 21, 2014, 05:22:47 AM

Title: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: jdman on May 21, 2014, 05:22:47 AM
I know that Brian(and possibly Tony) were on lead with Jan on Surf City. But it appears to me from listening that it's just the verses. I only hear Jan on the part "we're goin to Surf City cause it's two to one, goin to Surf City gonna have some fun..."

am I on the right track here? I only hear Jan on the chorus. Does anyone hear co-leads on the chorus?
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: 2dean2 on May 22, 2014, 12:09:25 PM
I think Dean said he could only hear Brian on lead . Like he drowned out Jan.
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: Admin on May 22, 2014, 06:44:15 PM
I think Dean said he could only hear Brian on lead . Like he drowned out Jan.

Silly Dean . . . you would have to be completely tone deaf to even think that about the lead vocals . . . let alone say it.

That was one of Dean's more bizarre-o statements to Doc Rock.

Moreover, Brian shed light on this many years ago in an interview. In describing how they doubled the lead vocal, Brian explained that Jan's voice was more prominent in the mix for obvious reasons. It wasn't a "Brian & Dean" record.

To answer jdman's question . . . I think they are doubling throughout; but it's certainly possible that Brian only sang on the verses.

M.

Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: jdman on May 22, 2014, 07:06:33 PM
Thanks Mark. Yes, Jan is definitely the prominent voice on Surf City. I read that interview with Dean. I thought that was a weird thing to say. But he had just confessed to "not even being on the song Surf City". So I guess he wanted to downplay Jan's role too.
I think there was a time during the eighties where Jan & Dean just were not getting along and they both said things to Doc that was less than nice about the other. Dean said the above and Jan said that Dean didn't do anything, not sing , not anything. They definitely were going through a tough time. I'm glad they made it through that and continued on.

I'm going to listen again. I really only hear Jan on the chorus, but Brian could be there too. ???
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: Admin on May 22, 2014, 09:38:29 PM

I listened again . . . and I can hear where you're coming from. It was 1963. My only hesitation is that I know of another famous song where Brian doubled with Jan on lead (concrete tape evidence), and on the released version, you can't differentiate between verse and chorus. Just sayin' . . .
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: jdman on May 23, 2014, 05:06:10 AM
are you referring to Drag City? That's a song that I only hear Jan on lead but it's possible there's another co-lead hidden a bit.
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: 2dean2 on May 23, 2014, 12:47:14 PM
I'm sorry to say but I dont know what Brian's 63 NON Falesetto voice would sound like as Mike sung lead . I never got that about what Dean said either.  He also has said him and Brian doubled on Falasetto . But I hear it was Tony doubling himself . You can hear another "wail" building in the middle of the first. What a sound Jan really knew what he was doing . Proving as on SWS another Brian cowriten tune . The Arrangement is as important .
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: jdman on May 23, 2014, 03:36:10 PM
I'm sorry to say but I dont know what Brian's 63 NON Falesetto voice would sound like as Mike sung lead . I never got that about what Dean said either.  He also has said him and Brian doubled on Falasetto . But I hear it was Tony doubling himself . You can hear another "wail" building in the middle of the first. What a sound Jan really knew what he was doing . Proving as on SWS another Brian cowriten tune . The Arrangement is as important .

Yes, I agree. The arrangement and production is what made the songs.
I think Dean was talking about when he and Brian sang co-lead on Barbara Ann.
As far as Brian's co-leads with Jan, it was just for support. It's hard to hear how his or Tony's voice really sounds. It's a common thing to do. Gary Lewis almost always had vocal support with Ron Hiclin( I think).  All the Gary Lewis songs had double leads, but you hear Gary's voice the most. Paula Abdul did it as well.
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: 2dean2 on May 24, 2014, 07:08:12 PM
 Yeah I understand Ted Nugent isnt the one singing on Cat Scratch Fever.
Dean has said that about the SC vocal BTY.
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: jdman on May 24, 2014, 08:34:27 PM
Oh, yes I believe I read somewhere that Dean said he and Brian did co-falsetto on SC. But he has also said that he wasn't on SC.
I'm pretty sure it was Tony on falsetto. It sounds like Tony. Brian did Surf CIty, here we come  part.

Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: Moon Dawg on May 25, 2014, 07:13:10 PM
 Did Dean sing on "Surf City" ?
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: jdman on May 26, 2014, 04:53:28 AM
I don't think so Moon Dawg. He said he didn't. Then he changed his mind. If he is on Surf CIty, it's only in the background. I don't hear Dean.
That's not to say he wasn't important to that recording. It's still a Jan & Dean record. He sang it live and promoted it. Plus, I think Surf City would have been number 1 with or without Dean. He certainly sang well enough to make it just as good as it was.
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: Moon Dawg on May 26, 2014, 06:29:06 AM
  Interesting. Memories become murky over time. I knew Brian was doing the falsetto but figured Dean was in the mix somewhere; perhaps he is.

  Similarly, there has been a lot of dispute as to who played on The Beach Boys' instrumental tracks. For years it was assumed that Dennis Wilson did very little studio drumming from "Little Deuce Coupe" through PET SOUNDS or SMILE, but Jon Stebbins corrected this misinformation. Turns out Dennis did a lot of stickwork 1963-65.

 Getting back to Dean's singing, it would be interesting if the session credits were still around somewhere.
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: jdman on May 26, 2014, 07:24:25 AM
Moon Dawg, one correction. I don't think Brian did a lot of falsetto on Surf City except the part "Surf City, here we come". Brian doubles with jan on lead, at least throughout the verses. It's Tony from the Matadors that does most of the falsetto on that one.
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: Moon Dawg on May 26, 2014, 07:27:49 AM
 Thx JDman. Again, I hear a falsetto on a Jan & Dean record and assume it must be Brian Wilson. Typical Beach Boys' fan, LOL.
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: jdman on May 26, 2014, 08:24:23 AM
Thx JDman. Again, I hear a falsetto on a Jan & Dean record and assume it must be Brian Wilson. Typical Beach Boys' fan, LOL.

LOL, come on Moon Dawg!  Dean actually sang falsetto on a lot of Jan & Dean songs too. In fact, most falsettos that replaced Dean were actually Phil Sloan and Tony. Some Brain too. lol
By the way, I just bought Beach Boys Today album. Brian was really stepping it up at that point. His production was reaching it's stride. Really good stuff!
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: rob on April 30, 2017, 12:12:23 AM
Not sure who's singing falsetto on this one, but Jan told me it was a trio of singers singing the lead in unison, all around the mic at the same time.  It was Jan, Tony and I don't recall who the third person was...
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: NateRuvin on May 05, 2017, 07:11:42 AM
So it sounds like we've got Jan on prominent lead vocals, with Brian doubling his voice. Jan, Brian and Matadors possibly with Dean on backing vocals too, and Tony on the signature falsetto maybe with additions Brian here and there
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: Admin on July 01, 2017, 02:53:55 AM
So it sounds like we've got Jan on prominent lead vocals, with Brian doubling his voice. Jan, Brian and Matadors possibly with Dean on backing vocals too, and Tony on the signature falsetto maybe with additions Brian here and there

That's pretty much it. The Matadors were the main backing vocalists, with Jan singing bass in the harmonies, for sure. Brian doubled with Jan on the lead vocal.  No question there. And Brian contributed some falsetto lines, "Surf City, Here We Come."

But if you listen to the isolated opening . . . "Two Girls for Every Boy" . . . it's clearly not Brian Wilson on lead falsetto.

Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: Admin on July 01, 2017, 02:55:52 AM
are you referring to Drag City? That's a song that I only hear Jan on lead but it's possible there's another co-lead hidden a bit.

"Ride the Wild Surf"
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: jdman on July 03, 2017, 06:02:11 AM
Yes, Ride the Wild Surf seems more consistent. Surf City definitely had at least two voices on the verses. But I still stand by my earlier comments that the chorus seems to only have Jan. If Brian is co-lead during the chorus, it certainly seems that he takes a step back. But I don't know. I hear Jan the most.
I wish there could be a book or documentary dedicated to Brian and Jan's friendship and collaboration. But only if it's done in a way that honors the time frame. Too many people talk about that with Pet Sounds in mind. Obviously, Brian became a legend. But in 1963, the admiration was mutual and the benefit was received on both sides.
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: 1Jay1 on July 03, 2017, 08:04:27 AM
a good idea, i d love a tv program or a book on jan and brian, then beachboys fans will know how much brian learned from jan.
Title: Re: Co-lead vocal on Surf City
Post by: jdman on July 03, 2017, 12:24:06 PM
Exactly, and Mark does a great job expressing that. Of course, Brian was very important to Jan & Dean as well. I would never discount that. But it was mutual and reciprocal.